End Game unbuffed DPS comparisons

[Laiina]

I realize this thread is mainly for melee DPS, but thought it might be of interest to post my 65 Clerics'. (magelo 884343 if you want to see complete stats).

2 hour span on the Exterminator VIII in Ak'Anon (the level 40 with something like 6 million HP). This guy is perfect for weapon tests, as he is pretty much unkillable, and he only hits you for 1-3 points, so you can get stats from 100% combat. I primarily used him for comparing various weapons and types of weapons on my Ranger, but was curious what a cleric would do.

No buffs of any type. Using the clerics summoned hammer only, no nukes:

Total DPS: 27.27
Hammer damage DPS: 9.63
Process effect DPS: 16.52

For info, I had a short run (about 20 minutes), of max buffs for dex, haste, and str - for that short period she did just under 41 DPS.

Feel free to delete this post, just posting for general interest.

[waza]

thx a lot Laiina
i was looking for a mob to try to parse my dps

Waza

[Laiina]

Just for interest and comparison, I tried him again with max buffs and avatars that I could get for about 20 min, was getting just under 60 dps

Not too bad for a cleric

In 20 minutes I managed to get him down to 96% HP .....

[Raaj]

This is pretty damn out of date. If someone feels like re-parsing with the new AA's and such we can make a new one, but pulling the sticky outta this for now and copying it to the library.

[Znarf]

Hiyas. I play a SK and am using this post to illistrate knight DPS. We are having some issues on the thread about the accuracy of this information.

Any chance you can add your professional opinion about accuracy and how much of a DPS shift any of the classes might have from say. The 301 Dex. The combat affects some people have and so forth?


The listed reasons for this thread not being accurate is Atk differences.
A belief that warriors have to have Anger 3 Augs and knights will have 150DD augs and that will boost knight DPS.


For my own knowledge DO warriors have to have anger 3 augs? I was starting to think myself that with Disc's and 2 good DD augs they would be able to hold aggro.

And any warriors out there with a DD aug in their DBs?

Thanks in advance for any replies.

[Celestias]

Originally Posted by Znarf

For my own knowledge DO warriors have to have anger 3 augs? I was starting to think myself that with Disc's and 2 good DD augs they would be able to hold aggro.

And any warriors out there with a DD aug in their DBs?Thanks in advance for any replies.

No, I use lifetaps I find even mini heals much more useful than an aug that only increases aggro where it is not necessary, aggro is easy with WA5 and Ancient Chaos Cry.

For people with low aggro weapons, yes , Anger augs are a good thing, but no need to aug a weapon with an aggro proc with ANOTHER useless proc, just one war's opinion.

[Znarf]

Thanks for the reply Celestias.

[Phantron]

You can never have too much aggro. While it's probably somoene else's fault to require you using 2 EB weapons with Anger 3 on them it's easier just to have those weapons than figuring out who's right. The fact people do DBoW + shield proves that aggro really isn't all that but try to explain that to someone when they die from overaggroing. It's easier just to never let the problem occur in the first place.

[Coroq]

I must agree with Phantron. Although I build insane aggro after tanking a mob for 2 minutes, BoM and ATaunt are the only hate I can count on in the first 20 seconds. And there seems to be a few places in GoD where I need aggro fast or else healers get eaten. Those 2 anger 3 augs, enhanced with WA5, add nicely to the chance that I get a much needed hate proc or 3 at the start of a fight.

[Derrict]

Loading up on +hate procs simply increases the probability of firing an early proc to gain that quick snap aggro. Most encounters, Time+ equipped warriors have no problem locking down aggro but it's making sure you keep it in the first moments when engaging.

[Battleblade]

Exactly my opinion. I want as high initial aggro as possible as soon as possible. Later in the fight you might not be able to pry the mob off me with a crowbar, but from first contact until 30 seconds into the fight it can be quite dicey.

DBoW/EoE both with anger augs, Symbol of the Planesmater, Raex BP, and WA5. If I could increase my chance of a high aggro proc early in the fight I would.

BB

[Znarf]

Thanks all for your replies.

Is this all raiding? or do you feel this need in groups as well?

I like to think outside the box. I'm starting to wonder if I should jump back in or just be more aware or the differences between raids and groups.

[Celestias]

Maximizing your aggro is only important if your tanking the mob, otherwise just pull out a cool DPS combo or 2hander . I got a nice one from Inktu I like , the jade axe of Veangence, I am quite fond of it, however, at 45/22 (fast 2h much better ratio than Darkblade + Onyx Staff for DPS) it is medium aggro, not really Reliable in comparison to DboTW. Its a great weapon for Exp groups, duoing, etc. as are many other weapons that dont have Anger procs. Weapons like these can easily be made into Aggro weapons by adding Anger 3, but you really should know what you want a weapon for when you pay the DKP for it, and I still feel that its a waste to anger up every weapon in your arsenal with LDoN Anger III augs, just a waste of potential DPS procs.

Darkblade alone with Ruj 150 DD or 75 lifetap is a awesome aggro weapon, there really is no need for an anger 3 aug on a weapon that alrdy has an aggro proc unless you really are just that lazy and cant hit taunt and use range to draw aggro off a PC. The only way I can merit someone having 2 Anger 3 augs on their dual combo are those with low dmg weapons like BoC or Bloodfrenzy and rely simply on the proc for holding aggro. Most High end guilds dont have a MT, they have 3-5 warriors who share tanking responsibility's and in some situations are all required, at other situations one tank required. Unless your a warrior who is crazy egotistical (like some warriors tend to be) and must ALWAYS have aggro over another warrior simply because you know you have 200 hp more than them so are "better", than sure, anger 3 a high aggro weapon up and try and rip aggro off of each other. If your a warrior who works with your guild and shares responsibility and tanking roles, you simply do not need it That is basically all, and i'm glad to be the latter.

Anyways, the point i'm trying to get at really is, if you only want to ever use your dual wielders your going to have to cycle alot more with Anger 3 when its not your turn tanking, I feel that a waste to make a weapon combo so aggro-driven that its nearly impossible to defer to someone else even if you try, without switching weapons. There is such a thing as going overboard, you just dont need that much control in the raiding atmosphere and especially the group atmosphere unless your guild just doesnt know how to play the game.

[Timmok]

Anyways, the point i'm trying to get at really is, if you only want to ever use your dual wielders your going to have to cycle alot more with Anger 3 when its not your turn tanking, I feel that a waste to make a weapon combo so aggro-driven that its nearly impossible to defer to someone else even if you try, without switching weapons. There is such a thing as going overboard, you just dont need that much control in the raiding atmosphere and especially the group atmosphere unless your guild just doesnt know how to play the game.

Swapping weapons is only a problem if you have lazy warriors. Imo all warriors ought to have 2 different setups, one for DPS and one for keeping agro. Those who try to do it all with one combo(like sticking DD augs on a dbotw) arent doing as well in either category as they could with 2 different setups.

Pretty much all the warriors in my guild that want it, have dbotw+eod/bf combos, and they switch to vanazirs when they dont want agro.

I really fail to see the wisdom of establishing an agro floor for your 5 warriors that is 2-4 anger3 ppm lower than similar 5 warriors that all are auged up. For what, a lousy 5x 7-10 dps more for those 5 warriors?

IMO over-time agro is not the primary reason for augging with Anger3, it is increasing the chances for an early agro-locking proc that is the primary idea.

Good example would be an uqua trap, 5 inc mobs you need to establish agro on pretty fast. Unless you rely on riposte discs to do your job here, you pretty much need to get a proc in, or you wont be able to hold your mob.

Seems a waste of a good weapon(dbotw) to aug it with a DD aug. Also makes keeping agro when using a dbotw+shield combo even harder(not that this is commonly needed, but its nice having the option).

[Celestias]

Good example would be an uqua trap, 5 inc mobs you need to establish agro on pretty fast. Unless you rely on riposte discs to do your job here, you pretty much need to get a proc in, or you wont be able to hold your mob.

Seems a waste of a good weapon(dbotw) to aug it with a DD aug. Also makes keeping agro when using a dbotw+shield combo even harder(not that this is commonly needed, but its nice having the option).

I see where your coming from here, only 1 or 2 of our wars have gone as far as to aug even 1 weapon of their dual combo with anger 3, and usually it's been their offhand. I guess it is debatable, I just dont like to have to bag my dual wieldies every time i'm not tanking so it is preference at a cost. You could do well with anger 3 augs but also can get by without them just fine with the proper assortment of weapons. I'm just not in line with the fact that some say you HAVE to have both weapons anger 3'd in order to succeed, because obviously thats just not the case. Since i've gotten Jade axe of vengence i've been using that mainly and switching to dual for aggro combo, didnt like vanazir enough to take it thus the use of my dual wielders most of the time even when not tanking, and probably reason for not anger 3ing them up, but they still do the job when I need them to ^.^).